i am so ready for the world cup to start!.
who are you pulling for?.
what players are you looking forward to watching?.
lepermessiah
I enjoy watching rugby much more than football. For me, rugby is more intersting to watch. For such an aggressive game, rugby seems to attract a more peaceful, better-mannered crowd with more discipline thran the more popular footbal. Today sees 2 games from the start of the Six Nations - I can't wait to see the action...
so, for those who's passion and main interest is football, have a fantastic World Cup! I'll certainly watch the final few games, though!
lifelong humanist
i've often said that the term/description "atheist" tell us so little.
the author below provides some descriptions that are more meaningful.. .
upon reviewing the list, i'm of the opinion that "religious atheists" are very common, but they are also likely to be "closet atheists".. .
leavingwt
Here are my ratings from the assessment list:
1) Gnostic
2) Positive
3) Broad
4) Friendly
5) Open
6) Active
7) Non-religious.
Have I won anything with these answers? Only kidding...
lifelong humanist
i was having an affair with a pioneer at the time and a girl who was disfellowshipped was in the loo at the hall (she actually had not done aything scriptually wrong (but the elders thought she had ) i tried to smile at her as i felt i was not in a position to judge anyone as guilt was destroying me but she just looked down at the floor , 14 years later we are good friends and both "free".
when you were "in" and ignored disfellowshipped did you ever think "im not in a position to judge anyone " ?.
looloo
When active in the cult, I believed that it was an insane, inhumane response to 'just walk on by' pretending DFd or DAd people were unworthy of common human decency. I would always greet them, and speak with them if they felt so inclined. I maintain that this is only being civil, and dispalying good manners. I got myself into trouble over this quite a few times, but carried on regardless.
When I DAd myself in 2003, I can count on one hand how many times a cult member has even made eye contact with me, far less exchanged a greeting. At first I found this distinctly odd, but it was what I expected of the 'loyal' shunners - now I really know that the JWs are members of one of the world's most mind-controlled cults and have to obey rules imposed on them by their bosses. It really is a sad situation to behold, and I can only guess at the damage it must be doing to the 'real personality' of the JW who plays along in this nasty game of shunning! It just completely goes 'against the grain' of anyone with a shred of humanity. Surely, most JWs have some of that?
lifelong humanist
i've often said that the term/description "atheist" tell us so little.
the author below provides some descriptions that are more meaningful.. .
upon reviewing the list, i'm of the opinion that "religious atheists" are very common, but they are also likely to be "closet atheists".. .
leavingwt
Yet another interesting thread, Donny. This one certainly makes any type of 'atheist' sit up and ponder over their beliefs, or lack of, beliefs.
I'm sure that I've seen a list something like this somewhere else - I'll be happy to let you know 'where I stand' once I can decide! I'm cooking some smoked ham right now (noticed you've started a thread on eating meat as well) for tonights dinner - it smells as though the oven is maybe set too high...
lifelong humanist
just wondering if anyone here left the org without ever looking at anything on the net and if so how did it happen for you?.
miss c.
Miss Chievous
Interesting post.
I DAd in 2003 as I came to the conclusion that there 'probably is no god'and realized that i was a humanist. It wasn't easy. My wife is still in the JW cult. The good news, though, is that our 4 sons are all out of the mind-control and leading good lives.
In my opinion, anyone tempted by the false dreams of becoming JWs that researches JWs online, and, despite the warnings believes that JWs have the 'truth' are just kidding themselves. I hope that internet, or library based, research will speed up the exit of many countless, gullible people that have been already been conned into joining and becoming baptized members. For them, the shunning policy will/can be very hard to bear - but 'doing the right thing' isn't easy!
lifelong humanist
i'm going to ask you a question.
but first, i'm going to set the question up properly.. the original christianity became officially established when the catholic church found constantine as its protector and defender in the mid 4th century.. that church grew mighty, powerful and exerted an influence over vast reaches of the earth.. the church had an absolute fetish for anything of nature deemed "holy" that might be a relic of jesus or his apostles or (as time went by) any saint.. this took the form of conserving the true cross, splinters from the true cross (one in the pope's ring!
) the bones of martyrs, robes, chalices, knuckles, fingers, etc.
Terry
Another interesting post, posing a thought provoking question.
I've visited the Vatican museums on several occasions. About 8 years ago, I was even naive enough to wonder if I asked one of the Swiss Guards politely enough, that he'd allow me access to the 'secret' vaults. Alas, no. Back then, I often wondered what ancient manuscripts must exist therein. I believe that the Vatican genuinely treasures their manuscripts even more than their 'holy relics'. This is probably why the public has very limited access to them. Perhaps a scholar investigating could clearly establish the (many?) changes that have been inserted over the centuries.
On the other hand, I must have seen 'hundreds' of bones from certain saints spread around Italian, French, Spanish and Greek churches, often not very well protected against theft.
I think it is farly well established that we know today as the 'Holy Bible' is just the 'selected bits' of text that scholars wanted to be included. A bit like a 'cut and paste' job. I doubt that they stuck closely to whatever the 'original' document stated. I'm sure that many fragments of other so-called holy writings exist within the Christian church (as well as the other major world religions).
When I was still trapped in the JW cult and, as Ministry School overseer, asked to deliver Instruction Talks based on the 'All Scripture is Inspired of God' book, I always found it strange how ready and willing the WTB&TS was to accept Roman Catholic and Protestant clerics views on who wrote each 'book', when it was written, where, etc. The same WT 'logic' took great delight in trashing everything else these churches teach and believe...
Now, I consider the bible as merely a history book, with amazing stories of giants and heroic characters, full of violence, genocide, strange, even miraculous goings-on, etc.
lifelong humanist
something is true if it matches reality.. a true statement cannot contradict reality.. but, the mind can interpret anything into its opposite.
all it takes is black and white thinking and a belief things should be otherwise.. if jeffrey dahmer's mother thought he was a good son, then, he could not possibly be the guy who is eating people.. if o.j.simpson was a fine, upstanding fella with a great personality, then, he couldn't possibly have brutally murdered two people with a large serrated knife.
a ton of proof means nothing when belief is everything.. black and white thinking won't permit any facts to slip by the core belief and become refuted.. are you guilty of black and white thinking?.
Terry
I just wanted you to know how much I enjoyed this thread you posted.
What you have expressed was well reasoned, logical, and beautifully written. Hopefully, anyone taking note of your points will benefit from seeking honest answers that work. It will produce a good effect in helping all types of people to be true to themselves. Similar expressions helped me appreciate the need to quit the JW cult, see things as they really are and not as how we want them to be. But it is tough! And you have to live with the consequences of loved ones around you that can't see in full, glorious technocolour!
Thank you.
lifelong humanist
i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.
however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.
i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).
paul from cleveland
Some excellent posts to your interesting thread...
Being a Scottish Humanist and atheist - my belief is that there is 'probably no god'. For me, this is an uplifting experience. Why not find out more about what Humanists believe and find out more about this ethical, moral stance that liberates the individual from the huge guilt, 'eternal reward sort of stuff that most religious people use to fill a 'spiritual void'?
lifelong humanist
Sour Grapes
I believe that there is no god, so, in harmony with my belief, believe that there will never be an Armageddon as some people believe is suggested in their holy book. However, natural disasters, often referred to as 'Armageddon' situations by the media, will sadly, always be with us - its just the way the natural world operates. Hopefully, advance warning systems will improve, and impending disasters may be curtailled, or even avoided. Regretably, this isn't likely to happen soon.
With such graphic detail of recent serious natural disasters, I think that more and more JW cult members will start to realize how 'crazy' the whole Armageddon concept is.
They can witness the frantic efforts of countless decent citizens acting tirelessly and selflessly in trying to do their best to rescue disaster victims, re-establish clean water supplies, bring in food, rebuild damaged structures, educate people to try and build safer homes, and allow the healing process from so many innocent fatalities to start.
lifelong humanist
i have been thinking a great deal about where i stand at this moment in time in terms of a belief in a creator verses a belief in an evolutionary process.
i think the best way to describe it is an exploratory path.
i look at what is around me and i acknowledge it is remarkable.
cantleave
Sorry, I pressed the wrong button!
Enjoyed reading through many of the posts on this interesting thread.
I'm more than happy with Dawkin's arguments for non-intelligent evolution. Intelligent Design seems just wrong, with animals and plants that seem to be 'badly designed', not 'fit for purpose'. Most lifeforms that we can examine have/are surviving because they work well and hence survive, most of the time. How long this will remain so, is a difficult question to answer.
The entire subject is just too complex for me to grasp - I'm just 'totally satisfied' and genuinely happy to accept that no 'god' was involved with the on-going evolution of the many millions of lifeforms inhabiting our strange planet.
lifelong humanist
